13:05:13 #startmeeting General IRC meeting 22 October 2014 13:05:13 Meeting started Wed Oct 22 13:05:13 2014 UTC. The chair is tcohen. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot. 13:05:13 Useful Commands: #action #agreed #help #info #idea #link #topic #startvote. 13:05:13 The meeting name has been set to 'general_irc_meeting_22_october_2014' 13:05:22 #topic Introductions 13:05:23 #info wahanui, a bot that has become sentient 13:05:28 Someone must have thought this was a good time for a meeting :| 13:05:33 Please introduce yourselves, using #info name 13:05:40 #info Paul Poulain, BibLibre 13:05:42 #info Tomas Cohen Arazi, Universidad Nacional de Cordoba 13:05:45 #info Owen Leonard, Athens County Public Libraries 13:05:54 #info Barton Chittenden, Bywater Solutions, Louisville KY USA 13:05:59 #info Jane Wagner, LibLime/PTFS 13:06:32 #info Magnus Enger, Oslo Public Library 13:06:38 #info Kyle M Hall, ByWater Solutions 13:06:53 #info Ed Veal, ByWater Solutions 13:07:10 ok, moving on 13:07:12 #info Dani Elder, ByWater Solutions 13:07:23 hie all 13:07:27 will wait for frido 13:07:42 #info Thomas Dukleth, Agogme, New York City 13:07:42 tcohen: here I am 13:07:51 #info Melissa Lefebvre, ByWater Solutions 13:08:37 moving on 13:08:41 #topic Announcements 13:08:42 good turnout from bywater :-) 13:08:53 any announcements? 13:08:56 paul_p? 13:08:56 hmmm... paul_p is the 3.8 release manager, and is very tall, and does not like coffee. 13:09:31 and has a beard! 13:09:32 mmm... not that I see (am I forgetting something ?) 13:09:59 (STRONG wind in Marseille today, but that's not an announcement for this meeting ;-) ) 13:10:12 heh 13:10:13 #info Bernardo Gonzalez Kriegel, Córdoba 13:10:57 tcohen: you found msaby :) 13:11:00 oh 13:11:09 #info Katrin Fischer, BSZ Germany 13:11:11 heh 13:11:16 cait: no 13:11:35 #topic Update on old releases 13:11:48 khall: 3.12? 13:11:49 rumour has it 3.12 is due to be released on May 22, 2013. Master entered a feature slush on March 15, 2013, and will enter a feature freeze on March 22, 2013 and a string freeze on May 1 13:12:00 #link : http://wiki.koha-community.org/wiki/General_IRC_meeting_22_October_2014 13:12:36 fridolin: comments on 3.14? 13:13:03 3.12 is getting to the point where there are few if any applicable patches 13:13:12 nothing special 13:13:31 #info Kyle says 3.12 is getting to the point where there are few if any applicable patches 13:13:38 I wich I could spend more time on intergrating patches 13:14:15 #info Fridolin says he doesn't have enough time to spend on integrating patches 13:14:32 are there any big bugs on those releases that need our attention? 13:14:39 i.e. help backporting? 13:15:09 remember we are here to help :-D 13:16:52 hey, one annoucement that everybody has probably seen : if you've a "forbiden date" for the Hackfest in Marseille in feb/mar 2015, drop me an email ! 13:16:53 omnipresent bgkriegel 13:17:28 ok, anyone wants to say something about 3.16? 13:17:29 I plan to choose the date in november 13:17:51 for a moment I read... a date in november :) 13:18:41 #info Marseille's dates will be chosen in November 2014, please answer Paul's email on "forbidden dates" before November 13:18:50 ok, update on 3.18 13:19:11 * tcohen hopes 3.18 shines 13:19:14 :-P 13:19:44 tcohen = any patch needing attention you'd like to see included ? 13:19:52 (for 3.18) ? 13:19:57 that's what i was looking for 13:20:23 I'd like to rise the "hea" patch, it's a very useful addition, no side effect, and will give us a lot of interesting informations about Koha users ! 13:20:42 paul_p: HEA is already integrated in my local branch 13:20:43 i've seen your email about some description, will send 13:20:51 waiting for some wording review 13:20:56 (will add a comment on the bz) 13:20:57 * oleonard is doing so now 13:21:02 oleonard++ 13:21:17 link to HEA in bugzilla? 13:21:25 are there dates for 3.18 feature freeze etc yet? 13:21:26 Bug 11926 13:21:27 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=11926 new feature, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Passed QA , HEA - Render community koha statistic usages 13:21:30 #link http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=11926 13:21:31 04Bug 11926: new feature, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Passed QA , HEA - Render community koha statistic usages 13:21:36 oleonard++ 13:22:12 tcohen = anything pending around plack or Unimarc & dom changes ? anything about facets in zebra ? 13:22:21 i was about to say 13:22:41 #info tcohen urges people to look at the plack related patches 13:23:07 #info Zebra facets should be tested a lot :-D 13:23:32 also, there are several UNIMARC patches that recently failed to apply 13:23:43 (my fault, because of the changes I made on the XSLT files) 13:23:50 thre is also a follow up for facets that needs signoff i think 13:23:50 okay, cait. 13:23:55 the pref for choosing the number of facets? 13:23:59 yes 13:24:20 tcohen: are there dates for 3.18 feature slush/freeze etc yet? 13:24:40 there will be another nso for warning the user in the about page for conflicting zebra facets configuration 13:24:52 paul_p: do you thik someon could take a look at the tests failing for bug 10860? 13:24:53 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=10860 new feature, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Failed QA , On-site checkouts (was In-House Use) 13:25:39 tcohen you mean someone excluding joubu that is afk for 3 weeks ? I don't think so. everybody too busy at BibLibre 13:26:13 s/tcohen/cait/, sorry 13:26:40 paul_p: I'll take a look at it. If it's something simple I can take care of it 13:27:08 * paul_p bet the test fail because of some missing data in the db... 13:27:13 thx khall 13:27:28 np! 13:27:38 khall++ 13:27:57 magnuse -- he gets that all the time ;-) 13:28:15 magnuse: feature freeze will be friday 31 13:28:26 or maybe because of the db changes and some test needs adjusting khall++ 13:28:35 khall: i am very interested in that feature, woudl be nice to see it move 13:29:04 tcohen: #info? :) 13:29:19 #info Feature freeze will be Friday 31 October 13:29:29 info Feature freeze for 3.18 is October 31 13:29:32 Wow that's really soon. 13:29:41 it is! 13:29:54 time goes by! 13:30:03 it sure does 13:30:30 i expect you all email me about those features you expected for 3.18 and are close to be finished 13:30:38 so we find the way 13:30:46 we still have a week and a half 13:31:05 and the PQA queue doubles the SO one in amount of bugs 13:31:06 me would like to see bug 11401 go in, but that is only of interest to norwegian libraries... 13:31:07 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=11401 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, magnus, Needs Signoff , Add support for Norwegian national library card 13:31:11 and feature freeze is not push freeze... but we need to have a deadline 13:31:22 to wrk thorugh the things in pqa i think 13:31:23 magnuse: that one is on the list 13:31:26 and give tiime for translators 13:31:33 yay 13:31:44 fell free to ask me for any help you might need to make it faster 13:32:21 that's an opt-in feature that wouldn't break any other feature 13:33:07 I'm also really willing to see the updatedatabase improvement, written by me, rewritten by marcel, going in. 13:33:18 will be a wunderbach improvement for sandboxes ! 13:33:26 yeah, that would be cool 13:33:29 paul_p: link? 13:33:29 i heard link was broken. Also, we don't know what tools you're using to create the marc, but there is probably an option in that tool. 13:33:35 and how about the big utf8 bug? 13:33:58 bug 11944 13:34:00 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=11944 major, P5 - low, ---, jonathan.druart, Passed QA , Cleanup Koha UTF-8 13:34:05 i'll be working on it today and tomorrow 13:34:09 woohoo! 13:34:10 bz 13068 13:34:13 tcohen++ 13:34:16 bug 13068 13:34:17 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=13068 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, paul.poulain, Signed Off , New feature for DB update and sandbox 13:34:46 i can add 3.18 to translation server soon, to give more time to translators (after feature freeze) 13:35:01 bgkriegel++ 13:35:33 #action Bernardo will add 3.18 soon on the translation server 13:36:22 tcohen about 13068, I'll sign-off asap (new signoff needed I think, as it's almost a complete rewrite). khall would you be OK to QA it after ? (ill' drop you an email once I've signed off) 13:36:26 #info Tomas has asked people who wrote new features / enhancements to drop some lines for the release notes, please contact him if you have something to say 13:36:55 paul_p: that's fine 13:36:58 bgkriegel++ :) 13:37:08 paul_p: absolutely! 13:37:14 it is mostly a change in the updatedatabase maintenance workflow 13:37:28 ok, moving on? 13:37:40 paul_p: ping me here as well once it's signed 13:37:49 * magnuse gotta run, sorry 13:38:06 If someone has time (magnuse) perhaps a look to Bug 7939 13:38:07 04Bug http://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=7939 enhancement, P5 - low, ---, bgkriegel, Needs Signoff , Separate po files for different MARC dialects 13:38:10 before we move on, PLEASE CONTACT ME for anything 3.18 related, better sooner than later 13:38:52 ok 13:38:53 also tell me if one of your patches is more important than another, so we can give it prio in qa 13:38:53 tcohen = can I get coffee with my 3.18 please ? 13:38:54 :D 13:39:05 sure :-D 13:39:17 #topic Code of Conduct 13:39:19 tcohen: alfajores please :) I am running out 13:39:48 #link https://github.com/gmcharlt/koha-code-of-conduct 13:40:26 thd: you proposed some ammendments 13:40:31 #link http://lists.katipo.co.nz/public/koha/2014-August/040462.html 13:40:58 #info The current code of conduct was distributed to KohaCon14 atendees 13:41:07 I also submitted a patch against the repository. 13:41:14 and fortunately we didn't need to use it 13:41:33 We hope that we would always never need to use it. 13:41:55 is your patch applied to the one in galen's repo? 13:42:23 i don't see it 13:42:59 The patch is against the repo but gmcharlt does not seem to have taken the time to post a branch with the patch. 13:43:17 ah 13:43:28 so we cannot vote on it?? 13:43:41 The content of the patch is the same as the text changes in my email except: 13:44:27 I correct a misspelling ant-harassment to anti-harassment and 13:44:51 the verbose phrase for 24 hours to 24 hours. 13:45:35 Yes I think that we should be able to vote on it as a whole or the parts in my email individually. 13:47:21 Does anyone have questions about my proposed amendments or specific amendments to it? 13:48:05 No had raised any on the mailing list when I had last checked. 13:48:50 I suggest that we vote on the proposed amendments as a whole. 13:48:57 i have no personal objections to the ammendments 13:49:21 same thing for me 13:49:30 If it fails we can enquire if there are objections to particular parts which might be changed. 13:49:37 yep. I'm good with the ammendments -- I really want to be able to harass ants again. 13:49:48 heh 13:49:57 heh 13:50:02 thdta 13:50:05 hi talljoy 13:50:12 hi tcohen 13:50:15 smuxi autocomplete seems, funny 13:50:16 (and my opinion about this code of conduct is that we never had any problem, so adopting a coc may be good, but no need to discuss it for years ;-) ) 13:50:37 #info Joy Nelson ByWater Solutions 13:50:47 paul_p++ 13:50:53 if there are no objections... 13:51:10 paul_p: My only concern is that if we would ever have a problem that we should have something more refined than the existing version. 13:51:27 thd = let's fix it when we face it then 13:51:34 "if it work, don't fix it" ;-) 13:51:35 yeah 13:51:47 ok, we agree on the changes 13:51:56 +1 13:52:00 +1 13:52:01 paul_p: I actually do not think that the existing language "works". 13:52:10 +1 13:52:13 +1 13:52:15 +1 13:52:16 +1 13:52:17 +1 13:52:21 +1 13:52:51 #agreed Thomas Dukleth ammendments to the CoC 13:53:19 #info CoC can be improved in future iterations 13:53:26 of course heh 13:53:37 #topic KohaCon14 13:54:08 #info KohaCon14 was a huge success for the local community, lots of universities 13:54:19 Maybe at some point someone will find some language to apply the wording to the mailing list etc. other than by some ambiguous invokation statement. 13:54:26 kohacon14 was awful. Very poor welcoming from argentinian ppl. Should we say more ? 13:54:28 :D :D :D 13:54:35 :-/ 13:54:36 lol 13:54:47 * talljoy is not sure who paul_p met.... 13:55:18 #actions Tomas will try to upload all presentations for the wiki 13:55:22 very small meat pieces in our plates, very cloudy weather. everything was wrong... 13:55:37 :) 13:55:39 naughty boy 13:55:46 (and a choir singing, oh my god, it was so awful...) 13:55:51 #action Tomas will try to upload all presentations for the wiki 13:56:14 * talljoy wonders who gave paul_p coffee this morning 13:56:26 talljoy reminder= I don't drink coffee ;-) 13:56:33 that's my point! 13:56:33 #action We are finishing the production of a short film about the Koha project/community history 13:56:34 and it's 4PM here 13:57:05 btw, bgkriegel_ we need to attend that interviews in 5 minutes 13:57:08 ok, back to being serious. 13:57:25 yeah 13:57:25 in case there's any newbie here: I was kidding. It was wonderful ! 13:57:35 :-D 13:57:42 tcohen: that sounds cool... who is producing it? 13:57:49 barton: :-D 13:58:35 barton = I don't know, all what I know is that we've all been interviewed one by one. and at the end, we had some words to say, they'll probably make a patchwork from them 13:58:54 "I AM THE KOHA" 13:58:56 barton (I've been itw in french. the result will be funny...) 13:59:16 we are putting subtitles to it 13:59:35 I hope ;-) 13:59:46 next topic ? (tcohen: look at your watch) 13:59:48 * barton looks forward to seeing that. 13:59:53 barton: we appointed two proffesionals to make the video 14:00:07 #chair paul_p 14:00:07 Current chairs: paul_p tcohen 14:00:10 :-D 14:00:13 already late! 14:00:19 #topic KohaCon15 14:00:21 :) 14:00:24 hey, no, I don't want to chair! 14:00:31 hahahahaha 14:00:38 (and I really don't know how to do it !!!) 14:00:38 bbl :-D 14:01:06 paul_p: There is almost nothing left. 14:01:09 KohaCon15, we've only one candidate, no news from them for some months. What should we do ? 14:01:34 i think write them an email :) 14:01:42 should we drop them an email to ask for confirmation of their application ? 14:01:54 ok, cait, we agree ;-) 14:02:00 Yes, exactly. 14:02:01 if you want, I'll do that. 14:02:20 that's ok for me 14:02:35 anyone objecting ? any objection ? 14:03:19 #action paul will drop a mail to nigerian candidate for KohaCon15, to check if they're still voluntering, as they're the only candidate, if they are, they win 14:03:22 #action paul_p is going to contact the Nigerian KohaCon15 applicants to get confirmation that they will organize KohaCon15 (no vote this year, as only one application) 14:03:32 heh :) 14:03:35 paul_p: type #action paul_p will send email asking only submitter about status of application for KohaCon15 14:04:04 i think we got that covered....in triplicate 14:04:13 next topic then: Actions from General IRC meeting 24 September 2014 14:04:53 I don't see any action. Am I missing something ? 14:04:56 paul_p: use #topic 14:05:03 talljoy I hope I won't forget ;-) 14:05:12 #topic Actions from General IRC meeting 24 September 2014 14:05:45 am I missing something ? 14:05:57 ... 3 14:05:58 I don't see anything paul_p 14:06:05 ... 2 14:06:17 ... 1 14:06:20 ok, next topic then 14:06:33 #topic Removing/amending "Preferably, patch writer and patch signer should not be from the same company or institution." 14:07:02 this topic has been discussed a lot in Cordoba, brendan wrote an email about the discussion on #koha-devel 14:07:18 any objection or comment ? 14:08:07 so let's vote ? 14:08:12 +1 14:08:16 +1 14:08:17 +1 14:08:20 +1 (of course) 14:08:36 +1 14:08:39 +1 14:08:44 -1 14:08:51 0 - but let's try and see 14:09:42 +1 14:10:34 no other vote ? 14:10:47 * thd distracted 14:11:08 ok, adopted then. (someone will have to explain me how to express results in the minutes...) 14:11:34 paul_p: use #info I think 14:11:43 or #agreed 14:11:46 yes ^ 14:11:57 what cait wrote 14:12:06 #agreed amending patch workflow +1 = 7 votes, -1 = 1 vote, 0= 1 vote 14:12:12 (is it OK ?) 14:12:23 (properly written I mean) 14:12:43 try it in french.... 14:13:02 #topic Set time and date of next General IRC meeting 14:13:08 * thd is unclear exactly what the amendment is. 14:13:35 thd = (look at koha-devel, brendan's email) 14:13:38 adding or removing? 14:13:50 thd: it will be possible to do an internal sign off on a patch 14:13:53 amending a guideline 14:13:54 thd: removing. 14:14:05 thd: so one developer of a company develops the patch, another can sign it off 14:14:16 "Proposal for a change in guidelines for the sign-off process in the Koha-community" was the subject 14:14:22 That is what I had thought sadly ;( 14:14:50 thd can always be reverted if abused. 14:15:35 I understand the legitimate motivation for lack of time and attention from others. 14:15:38 that's what was agreed on 14:15:39 I've been the one promoting this change for the longest time. Believe me, I would be the 1st to propose to revert it if things goes wrong ! 14:15:42 and to revisit it every release 14:15:47 yes 14:16:09 paul_p how is the next meeting time selected? 14:16:18 i will also push back patches for a second sign off if i feel it needs another set of eyes (like we do now with big patches too) 14:16:31 we move by 8 hours backwards i think 14:16:34 talljoy usually -8 hours. So 5UTC 14:16:41 okay and the date? 14:16:47 1 month forward? 14:16:54 yep, about a month forward 14:16:59 with some variation of the day 14:17:00 next meeting 5UTC, at which date ? nov 19th ? 14:17:15 no objection 14:17:18 close to release :) 14:17:24 yep. 14:17:27 close to release 14:17:31 sounds goot to me 14:17:32 Is 5UTC a good meeting time for a good number of people? 14:17:41 not i 14:17:43 need to check 14:17:44 oleonard kiwis like it, others don't ;-) 14:18:03 5UTC will be 4AM here. 14:18:10 midnight or so for me 14:18:11 (in France I mean) 14:18:18 eek 14:18:23 so not a good time for europe 14:18:25 sorry, 6AM. not so bad, but not good either 14:18:36 not good for europe or north america 14:18:37 hm 6 would be ok, but are you sure? 14:18:40 When did we decide to rotate instead of two meeting times in the same day? 14:18:58 We didn't, that was the previous procedure. 14:18:59 that would be midnight US EST. 14:19:26 Two meeting times didn't seem to work because of low turnout in the second meeting? 14:19:28 I thought the 2 meeting times was for dev meetings. Am I wrong ? 14:19:42 oleonard: When did we decide to revert to the previous procedure? 14:20:20 (the 2nd chairman will also leave the keyboard soon... in 10mn max) 14:20:43 paul_p: No, before the last general meeting we had two times for the general meeting also. 14:20:50 I don't think we should choose a meeting time when none present will be able to attend. 14:21:19 I think we should propose a widely acceptable time and encourage those for whom it doesn't work to propose a second meeting (with volunteer chair) 14:21:22 Exactly, which is why was choose two different times for the same meeting. 14:22:10 s/was choose/we had been using/ 14:22:43 Is 5UTC widely acceptable? 14:23:30 no. 14:23:31 what about 8UTC ? Should be OK for kiwis, and OK for europe. not exactly 8h shift, but 5 14:23:46 2 UTC was not widely acceptable and had led to empty meetings. 14:23:54 oleanard care to get up at 3am? 14:24:04 thd = it's wrong for everyone except aussies, kiwis, japan & china. But we have no chinese of japanese contributors... 14:24:09 talljoy: Nope 14:24:16 there is no such thing as a good time 14:24:32 sorry reboot 14:24:36 paul_p i say we go with the standard meeting protocol setting. 14:24:44 it's going to be bad for someone somewhere. 14:25:05 yep, I agree. 14:25:10 tallyjoy: which is why I thought two times seemed to be working much better than rotation. 14:25:19 i nominate you to host the second meeting then thd 14:25:49 Ok, I will host a second meeting on the date. 14:26:00 When should that be? 14:26:01 pick your time 14:26:02 nov 19th, then 14:26:25 5UTC and ... (thd, pick your time) 14:26:43 What was the second time we had recently? 14:27:21 22 UTC was it? 14:27:34 22UTC it is on 11/19 14:27:57 That was the second time which was supposed to work for NZ 14:28:01 thd : UTC, it's 5 / 13 / 21 14:28:17 (8 hours difference x3) 14:29:04 thd ? 14:29:05 thd is probably concerned that CCL, Pazpar2, and Zebra support should not be an either that or Solr/Lucene option. We need CCL and Pazpar2 for metasearch and we currently need Zebra for a Z39.50/SRU server. or concerned that indentation styles which do not collapse in vim lead to overly long lines which cannot always be broken across multiple lines. 14:29:07 21 UTC is also fine and might be better for local time adjustments. 14:29:57 I suggest both UTC 5 and UTC 21 on 19 Nov. 14:30:07 +1 14:30:22 #action next meeting november, 19th, will be made twice at 5UTC (chairman volunteer expected !) and 21UTC (thd chairing) 14:30:35 how do I declare the meeting end ? 14:30:45 paul #endmeeting 14:30:46 * paul_p newbie at chairing... 14:30:51 #endmeeting